Qantas revamps website: better bookings, fewer frequent flyer seats

You said it tmsmile, Qantas rarely misses an opportunity to devalue its Frequent Flyer scheme.

Qantas recently offered me double status credits to tempt me back, but really there just isn't enough to entice me to take up the offer. Even the Qantas First Lounge doesn't seem as special as it used to be, so I think my Red Roo days are over.

The only thing missing is the word 'enhancement.'  

What's the bet that Qantas used the 'E-word' but everybody ignored it because they know it'll just make us laugh? Or cry?

I have the same issue   - wants me to make nothing but redemption bookings

One of the nice perks of QFF is the ASA option, as mentioned, great way to earn SC's. If this goes it would definitely be a blow to the program IMHO. I agree you need to actively consider your FF program, but residency is a major factor if you ask me especially if you are topping off your FF account with a local credit card. Ofcourse there is the option of switching to CX (OW) or Krisflyer (Star and status is recognised on VA) and I know they also offer credit card earning options, but I feel in general you get the best treatment when belonging to a FF program belonging to an airline from your residency country.

Anyway, all is not lost....as yet......

You've still got 3 months and can do it over the phone without the "Phone Booking Fee."  After that it seems as though it will be tough.

Question is, should we do those AA mileage runs after we have asked AAdvantage for a status match challenge and ensure we obtain EXP Plat with AA whilst doing the runs? Redemptions are much better than QF with AA and combined with the 8 SWU you get a year (redeemable on any fare bucket for upgrades) it seems a pretty good deal!

One thing I am wonderingis whether it would be relatively more difficult to qualify for EXp Plat on AA obtaining 100K miles a year as opposed to obtaining 1200 SC a year. I have been wondering this for a while, same question would go for CX (you need 120K miles or 80 sectors for Marco Polo Diamond, which is OW Emerald).

One unknown with AA is what will happen after the merger with US is completed, although i doubt that redemption will become worse than it currently is with QF classic redemption awards. Big advantage of AA is ofcourse the free unlimeted upgrades you get when on AA metal and flying in Northern America and the Carribean, drawback is that you do not get lounge access when flying domestically (but the lounges aren't all that nice, might as well find a decent airport restaurant).

As for now QF still has an edge with ASA, just got the promo mail for the new website and ASA is prominently mentioned (despite the fact that they are very hard to find/ search on the new site).

KG! I've done the analysis for this! It depends on your travel patterns!

AY is also another good option due to Lifetime Platinum (Yes that's right, Lifetime Platinum/Emerald status!) - But redemption rates on AY is rubbish. On the flip side, their call centre staff are the most highly trained and proactive lot you could ever find! There is a lot to be said for the Finnish education system.

Any chance I can get hold of the spreadsheet to analyse what travel pattern I have and which FF suits me best? When you say AY is rubbish, does that mean you pay more for a C award Europe - Australia than with QF? I am really contemplating joining either CX or AA to rack up my points, but if AY works as well. Key would be to try to get a status match (maybe do a challenge) as starting from scratch is painful. 

Hi KG,

Happy to share my spreadsheet. It's rudimentary but in my opinion does the job.

AY rates are rubbish because of the following:

For AY Platinum you need to earn 150,000 Finnair Tier Points. Assuming you are an existing Platinum member you get an additional 25% so that brings it to 187,500 Award Points (Tier Points = Award Points and are a factor of 1.6 miles...AY measures in km). To redeem for AU to EU return in C on QF metal, you need to burn 640,000 Finnair Award Points. The ratio works out to be 3.41 i.e. You need to earn Platinum status 3.41 times to be able to redeem for the return flight.

For QF Platinum you need to earn 1,200 Status Credits (assuming you are already an existing Platinum member). According to the Status Credit charts the optimal way to convert Status Credit to points is to use the ratio of 360 Status Credit per 15,000 miles flown i.e. flying First Class. This works out to 50,000 points. Assuming also that you're an existing Platinum member you triple that figures due to cabin and status bonus, which brings it to 150,000 points. Points required for the same flight in C return is 256,000. The ratio for this works out to be 1.71 i.e. you need to earn Platinum status only 1.71 times to be able to redeem for the return flight.

Thanks TRB! Looks like an awful deal on AY.

Tried myself to derive how many SC's you get on a mileage basis with QF (assuming you fly full fare Y, can we say that you earn x amount of SC's per x amount of miles). It is hard as there seems to be no pattern and is dependent on the distance you fly. If there was a straightforward calculation method it would be easy to see whether you are better off with one program or another (e.g. If I do a rough calculation it seems that flying 120K miles, which would be enough to get MP Diamond, would net me around 1800 SC, so it seems that getting QF Plat would be easier attanable, as I would have to fly 80K miles). Calculation does not hold grounds as when you fly premium you would get more mileage (but also more SC's). One thing that is good is that you will earn SC's for the class you fly in when flying OW partners, whereas your (status) mileage differs greatly per partner (and thus the accumulation of status could be less easy with mileage rather than SC's).

Dear KG,

I agree.

The lack of straightforward convertibility makes comparison much harder. I am not surprised if that was the reason why airlines like QF and BA have used proxies like SC and Tier Points to decouple the direct relationship between miles flown and status earned. However there are some benefits to this depending on your travel patterns and travel budget.

In my analysis of the value of FFP, I have not used redemption as a goal. Therefore I have not measured the ability of redemption on a particular sector as a success factor. Instead I focused on the realistic ability to accrue points/miles within a 356 day period. This requires a certain amount of forward planning to one's travel calendar.

Realistic planning also takes into consideration the budget for travel. To use the example earlier, yes it would be realistic to fly QF 2 round-trips a year AU/UK BUT to hit Platinum you need to do them in First Class (to hit 1,200 SC you need to fly 1.66 round trips in First or 2.5 round-trips in Business) - That may not be realistic given the cost!

So really you should be putting forward a couple of possible itineraries - perhaps based on prior years travel patterns and consider the ability to accrue miles/points for each of the FFP under consideration. This should help you identify the FFP that provides the best value.

The reason I've not used redemption as a measure is due to the following:

1) If one is travelling on revenue bookings through the year, I considered if it was realistic to find the time to avail myself of that "free flight" (assuming of course you find availability!!!)

2) The objective of FFP is not really, in my opinion, about burning miles BUT about attaining status so that your treatment during travel improves holistically

3) Burning miles/points is most efficient for short haul sectors, as I've explained in some earlier post; you get more value redeeming short haul as the opportunity cost of purchasing is must higher per mile flown. Short haul redemptions are also easier to come by.

I have heard status matching with CX is relatively easy if you have the equivalent status with Qantas. (The only caveat is they will naturally enquire about your inteded flying with them {CX}). Although I was offered double status for three months from Qantas, it has done nothing to sway me back to Q from Virgin. Virgin may not have the best lounges (I'm not one to devote my limited time to hanging out in lounges), but other perks such as gold/platinum status with hotel chains is a true travel benefit not offered by Qantas. (That's in addition to excellent reward seat availability!)

The latest changes about to occur to the Qantas frequent flyer community re-enforces my decision almost 12 months ago to switch. "Q frequent flyer" offers less, and less as the days go by, almost congruent with their reducing share price.

Have you selected the region from the elft hand side?

There's also a little check box on the top right you need to select - show all classic award destinations

I think you are referring to a different screen. If you are logged in at the home screen, on the right side you get the "I want to" pulldown, with the option of "Make an Award Booking". Try that option and for classic awards it is missing about 80% of the destinations. Maybe QF dont realize the links to this screen are still displayed and active.

Which screen has this little check box in the top rh? On & off since 10am I've been looking for Frankfurt & Paris & they don't appear in the destination drop down box in the award bookings screen. Tried ringing QF but there's over a 10min wait. Assume everyone's got similar problems. What was so wrong with the old website? They've gone overboard with changes. Hate it.

OK...re-read this page & found the check box in the bottom LH corner of the 'book flights' tab. How silly of me to go to the 'award booking' tab which is still clearly displayed! Not convinced of improvements, so much clicking/scrolling - 10 clicks just to get to the date range I want next year.

Hear hear!

Whilst I am not sure if we can judge wether ASA awards have significantly devaluated on the one flight example (keep in mind cyclical factors) I too do have the feeling ASA are harder to get by. The SYD-HKG, SYD-CGK or SYD-PVG route always had availability for ASA at classic redemption rates, all of it has vanished now. I think time will tell when more people have search for ASA and are not able to book at reasonable cost.

One has to wonder the reasoning of QF behind this change. The QF FF program is a big money maker, but devaluating the program and taking away the one unique differentiator bewteen QFF and other schemes seems odd. People for sure will evaluate other options. Problem is that we do not have an other domestic carrier wwhich is part of a global alliance. If only VA would join star it would be great. I like OW for many reasons and if i would abandon QF, what is the other option? I would like to stay with OW due t my travel pattern. CX or AA seem the obvious ones, BA is an alternative (though redemption is very costly).

I guess QFF wants to further maximise their profits from thier FF program. Although they have a lot of members i doubt that the members are actually flying that much, my guess is they have a lot of household accounts who earn points by shopping or credit card spend (and maybe occaisionally fly). For the real savy travellers, who thankfully made use of getting "cheap" SC's via ASA, they are making the program way less attractive. Then again, the active FF are probably travelling per corporate policy, so QF would get the revenue in any case and making redemption more expensive adds to QF's bottomline.

I have written QF asking what the reasoning is behind their new booking engine, explaining my disappointment in both lay out as availability. let's see what they come back with.

Besides all the negativity around QF, I must say I do enjoy the fact that you can now redeem for EK flights, a very welcome change and something you are not able to do when a member of another OW FF program. AA does have a partnership with EY which enables you to redeem tickets.

KG, the trick (just in case you missed it) is to look for classic award inventory on the new system for the class/route you want. Then call QF and book that seat via ASA over the phone.

Also, are you aware of the AA platinum challenge

https://www.flyerguide.com/wiki/index.php/Challenge_(AA)

Never tried it myself - others may be able to advise on the practicalities 

Thanks PLATY, I did not quite get that one and to be honest, looking forward to hear feedback as to wether this trick will work and in how many cases.

I do know the platinum challenge, recently AA actually also had an EXP Plat challenge, which is rare as they nrmally never offer this. Bets of it all, they did not ask for a fee! I did not partake, might do so during the next offer.

I tested out the ASA by phone. I located a U class (ie business classic award seat) on the new booking engine for SYD-HNL and then rang QF...sure enough (after a long wait whilst they checked it all out) they could offer me that seat as an ASA for the usual 72,000 pts plus around $400 in gasoline gouge rip off fees...so evidently possible