No economy seats on Singapore Airlines' long-range Airbus A350
By David Flynn, May 24 2017
Singapore Airlines' new Airbus A350-900ULR – the ultra long-range jet which will restart non-stop flights to New York and Los Angeles – will sport a two-class configuration without any economy seats.
As first reported by Australian Business Traveller, the super-efficient airliner – created by Airbus at the behest of Singapore Airlines and now being shopped around other airlines, among them Qantas – eschews an all-business class layout, but the Star Alliance member has to date refused to drawn on the precise make-up of its dual-cabin config.
However, a source inside Singapore Airlines has revealed to Australian Business Traveller that the A350-900ULR – due to take wing in 2018 – will sport the widely-tipped mix of business class and premium economy cabins.
Both seats will adopt next-generation versions of SQ's current designs, including the new business class set to debut on the airline's factory-fresh Airbus A380 superjumbos arriving from October 2017 (alongside all-new A380 first class suites).
Read more: Singapore Airlines'new six-suite A380 first class layout leaked?
Expected to springboard from today's Boeing 777-300ER 'Next Generation' business class launched in July 2013 (shown below), the seats have already been showcased to selected top-tier KrisFlyer travellers behind closed doors at Singapore Airlines HQ in order to fine-tune more practical aspects of the design.
Singapore Airlines has decided against including a compact first class cabin at the pointy end, arguing that the quality of its new business class seats - and the premium price tag attached to the non-stop flights – would minimise demand for first class.
Airbus Executive Vice-President for Strategy and Marketing Kiran Rao revealed to Australian Business Traveller in March 2016 that "during the evaluation Singapore Airlines did ask for a regular economy class seat" for its seven-strong A350-900ULR fleet.
However, the airline felt that price-sensitive economy class passengers would more likely to opt for the cheaper fares on a stop-over service.
Singapore Airlines is expected to retain one stop-over route to Los Angeles and New York alongside its non-stop services, in the same way that it now flies direct from Singapore to San Francisco (on the standard A350-900) as well as to San Francisco via Hong Kong (on a Boeing 777-300ER).
The airline currently flies to Los Angeles via Tokyo and Seoul, and to New York via Frankfurt.
Just 162 seats makes for a premium Dreamliner
A preliminary LOPA ('layout of passenger accommodations') chart sighted by Australian Business Traveller indicates the A350-900ULR will be fitted with 68 business class seats – almost 2½ times as many as on SQ's standard A350 – and 94 premium economy seats (in a standard 2-4-2 arrangement).
That total of 162 seats is close to Airbus' original expectation, as first reported by Australian Business Traveller, that the A350-900ULR would be fitted with "around 170 seats", and is almost 90 seats less compared to SQ's standard A350 complement of 253 seats.
It also happens to be close to the original two-class configuration of the Airbus A340-500s which Singapore Airlines flew non-stop to NY-adjacent Newark with 64 business class seats and 117 'executive economy class' seats, before the airline modified the jet to have 100 business class seats from tip to tail.
Approached for comment by Australian Business Traveller, a spokesman for Singapore Airlines responded "We will announce and confirm details of the cabin layout of the A350-900ULR closer to the aircraft's entry in to service."
Singapore Airlines’ A350-900ULR is also expected to deliver the full Airspace experience of Airbus’ new-wave cabin design (show below).
Also read: Can Singapore Airlines' Airbus A350 redefine long-range flying?
David Flynn is the Editor-in-Chief of Executive Traveller and a bit of a travel tragic with a weakness for good coffee, shopping and lychee martinis.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
14 Feb 2017
Total posts 25
Will be interesting to see fill rates and whether this is feasible long term.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
21 Jan 2014
Total posts 320
I think this is the future for premium carriers, there are vast savings on limiting the different meals etc that has to be provided, the key will be filling the PE seats and the price point , then shuffle the economy travellers toward a LCC.
20 May 2015
Total posts 579
I agree to a substantial extent. I think we'll see more airlines operate a dual-brand strategy with "Air Prestige" and "Air Cheapo", with the latter handling the largest volumes of price-determines-everything passengers on larger jets connected to megahubs, and the former handling the smaller volumes of passengers willing to pay a premium for direct flights/more comfort/etc. using smaller jets.
Turkish Airlines - Miles & Smiles
08 Jun 2014
Total posts 262
They'll get me as a client, PE to LAX or SF from SIN!
31 Mar 2016
Total posts 619
@MattJelonek:
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
26 May 2014
Total posts 465
Perhaps SQ can differentiate the ULR PE product by offering more legroom & recline than their standard PE product. Otherwise a stop along the way is arguably preferable.
31 Mar 2016
Total posts 619
@GregXL:
03 May 2013
Total posts 679
Qantas take note....A350ULH.......... 8 A380 dumped orders = ? A350ULH
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
10 Apr 2013
Total posts 387
Qantas would prefer an A350-1000 ULR versions get closer to the 300 seat mark.
31 Mar 2016
Total posts 619
@Chris2304:
31 Mar 2016
Total posts 619
@Joe:
QF
11 May 2015
Total posts 28
I had a number of flights on the SQ A340-500 non stop EWR - SIN with all business class seating (1-2-1). My longest flight was almost 19.5 hours, and bearable in that configuration. However when SQ introduced the A380 JFK-FRA-SIN I preferred that flight - a bit longer but a bit cheaper too. The proposed Business/Premium Economy configuration for the A350-900 ULR looks good but I will still prefer to go on an A380 via FRA in business and get out for a walk and shower there.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
14 Feb 2017
Total posts 25
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
15 Mar 2016
Total posts 167
A lot of major carriers now have very long haul routes - QF, QR, EK, SQ just to name a few. Look at Dallas <-> Sydney loadings and they're always really good, even in Y. It hasn't yet proven to be a deterrent it would seem. PER -> LHR will be a bit of a litmus test as there are other viable, proven routes that pax can opt for with a myriad airlines. So will they choose direct, in less time but with no stop and higher cost, or add a stop? I suspect in Y, $$$ will often win unless you're travelling Y on company dime and they want you somewhere ASAP.
31 Mar 2016
Total posts 619
victort:
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
14 Feb 2017
Total posts 25
Just based on my own personal tolerance for flying in Econ. Other people will have different level of tolerance vs $$$ so that's why i raised the point. Some are happy to fly 20hrs non stop - but for me, after even 5hrs in Econ i just wanna get out!
31 Mar 2016
Total posts 619
Understand and thx. So whenever U fly Y fm AU(Except Darwin) to:
16 Nov 2011
Total posts 580
My limit is about 12 hours. If it's unavoidable like LAX then will put up with it. But to UK sorry but I won't get into Y on a QF789 anytime soon flying non stop from Perth.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
05 May 2017
Total posts 1
I've flown the SIN->NY direct on SQ - A340 if I am not mistaken - 120 J seats in 1+2+1 config. Must say 17 odd hours on the same plane/seat was weird. Did arrive rested and got it all "out of the way" but it was still a few days at the other end to get into the zone.
31 Mar 2016
Total posts 619
@MrDamage:
QFF
12 Apr 2013
Total posts 1564
Current economy should go to LCC altogether and banned on full service airlines. Current PE for such airlines should be norm for lowest class.
31 Mar 2016
Total posts 619
@Serg:
QFF
12 Apr 2013
Total posts 1564
@FLX1
Do not worry - it was just my wish-list and it never happens :-)
Actually too tight seats are health hazard. Stupid suggestions like walking from time to time in practice does not work - imagine all Y pax on A380 wish to walk. So IMHO it must be regulated.
FSC already charging much more comparing to LCC without providing much benefits for Y pax comparing to LCC. So if they will be obligated to install seats with dictated minimum pitch and width they can still make money selling them at current pricepoint. I guarantee you that if such regulation came in place and FSC became obligated to fit Y seats at as least certain width/pitch then it will not make flying with them more expensive - it is not the case that they have higher cost and therefore charge more, but they cannot charge even more because of LCC exist.
But it just my dreams, so you can safely ignore them :-)))
31 Mar 2016
Total posts 619
@Serg:
QFF
12 Apr 2013
Total posts 1564
@FLX1
I am too lazy to type answers on all your questions, so just few picked.
"More importantly, tight seat is a health hazard on FSC but not LCC? Do LCCs always get healthier pax than FSCs?"
Of course not! But then pax can choose what is more important for them - their health or saved dollar.
I STRONGLY hated all deregulation in aviation and strongly believe that because of deregulation we have such miserable travel experience nowadays. "Worldwide trend" never equals "right choice". Some stuff must be regulated - herd will die for a dollar even if saving posing health hazard to them.
" What qualifies as a LCC or FSC?"
Carrier should decide by themselves. And clearly advertise it everywhere. If say SQ start to say that they LCC, then they will not be able to sell their seats for as much as today because they will be compared to other LCC. But if they like to call themselves FSC they have to comply with rules. It is that simple.
All other stuff just advocating greediness of airlines and/or flying herd that wanna save a dollar and thus IMHO do not worth to comment. I am not supertall or superheavy, about 182cm and 95kg and I physically cannot fly in today's economy for more than 4 hr or so - I became so exhausted that I have to recover for two days after flying to Europe or back. Thanks to greedy herd that wanna save a dollar.
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