NSW scraps hotel and home quarantine for overseas travellers

The real question Australians should be asking is: "When did NSW assume the current Federal Rights to determine Immigration Policy?"

Whilst I personally applaud NSW's wish to try to accelerate our progression out of COVID, it is particularly and noticeably sad that the current Federal Government is clearly MIA (missing in action) and that the individual states are now seemingly free to do as they like. That is not how our national Constitution is written or meant to work.

Gladys generally managed the NSW response with a competent state-based policy and would occasionally place a well considered bit of pressure on the Federal Government to push them along. It seems that our new Premier is intent on usurping control and assuming that he has the ability to determine Federal policy. Big mistake.

He has spoken with ABC News this morning and is alleging that he has been in contact with the Federal Government. An alternate view s coming from the Federal Government, with a big fat but decisive 'no comment' being issued. I guess somebody will need to run in and wake up our snoozing PM ?

Scooters probably spitting chips because he didn't get to make the announcement, hence a terse no comment.  I do wonder though whether this has been fully thought through in terms of immigration and customs arrangements. 

Whinge whinge whinge.  Every other state has been doing whatever they want.  NSW needs to move forward.

As the federal government has been saying for 18+ months quarantine is a state issue. 

As for immigration, unless I am mistaken the federal government had already announced the lifting of restrictions. 

And frankly do you think nsw would do this without knowledge of the Federal Government. 

They aren't determining the immigration policy.  The federal govt can still say who can come in and out.  All the NSW govt is doing is saying that they won't require quarantine.

I think Josh Frydenberg mentioned the state premiers have discretionary powers under the 2015 bio security act. (Not sure if I got the name of the act correct). He clearly intimated its time to wind back. 

No, NSW did not determine Immigration policy, it's determined its own quarantine policy - which it has delegated authority from the Commonwealth to do (as was given to all the states by the feds at the start of Covid).

Hi John,

Perrottet clearly did seek to determine Immigration policy by firmly stating that foreign tourists would be allowed to enter Australia from the 1st November, 2021. 

That was the issue that caused the PM to spring to attention in his 2:35pm Press appearance to make a clear and decisive statement that the Immigration Policy would ONLY include Australian citizens and their immediate family, as well as permanent residents - not foreign tourists. 

The quarantine policy - as you mention - is a State policy, under delegated Authority. However, Immigration matters and Quarantine policy are two quite different matters.

@AJW - the Federal Government has developed and released a four stage plan for emergence by the nation from COVID. That plan is still current and is the love-child of the Department of Immigration and the Department of Homeland Security.  

When NSW passed the 80% first jab point last weekend, we (Australia) moved from Stage A to Stage B. The total removal of Immigration restrictions on foreign individuals entering Australia for tourism purposes, does not occur until Stage D - which we are nowhere near.

As to your question on whether I would "think that NSW would do this without the knowledge of the Federal Government" - the answer is two-fold. 1) No, Gladys would NOT have done this. 2) Yes - Perrottet actually made a statement in his morning briefing today alluding that he had discussed this with the Federal Government. 

However, the new Premier was faced with the revelation that his letter to the PM was dated today - by the PM. So, yes - dumb stuff does happen, especially when you get inexperienced individuals in places of power, or 'presumed' power in this case.

Yes, QF1/2 services operated through there in Mar 2020. Not a full payload to LHR from there though I don't believe.

Correct, I was on the first LHR-DRW and it was not full and most of the luggage didn't make it, both due to weight.

Darwin Airport is actually a RAAF base. It can take the biggest aircraft in the skies.   

Yes, not to mention a NASA space shuttle alternate.

I’d be asking if the A380 is ready for the Darwin Runway , it’s not the flattest runway anyone has seen.

A380s can land at DRW. I was there a few years ago when an EY380 diverted there for medical emergency. The A380 is actually very good for runway loading given its size. 

DRW does not have A380 triple gate so boarding and deboarding a full plane would be slow but not impossible

Majority of states don't need a 'restart' as their economy never stopped.

Majority of other states are country towns in comparison! Ha! Sydney is an international hub that does the heavy lifting for all of Australia - just saying!

Some state economies are referred to as "welfare states", the interesting thing I saw after checking the world covid data is that eventually covid gets into the whole community. It's just a matter of time before a state gets slammed by covid.

traveller240468

so what ?

Everyone gets covid eventually. Doesn't kill you if vaccinated.

Sure about that? There are some families who will have lost vaccinated loved ones who will prove you wrong.

I agree  100% Get Vaccinated 

@andyf

The key is what is meant by “TGA-approved” (btw J&J is approved for use in Australia)

Googling “COVID-19 vaccines not registered in Australia but in current international use - TGA advice on "recognition"” brings up a list of vaccine not approved for use in Australia but recommended by TGA for “recognition of vaccines not registered in Australia” for international travellers (note that the list also discussed those vaccines not recommended for recognition)

This would be important for NSW government if their intention is to open to international students and tourists from China and India whereby one Chinese (Sinovac) and one Indian-made AstraZeneca vaccine are regarded as recognised vaccines.

Furthermore the other issue is whether the post double vaccination period of 10-14 days needed to occur before travellers are considered to be vaccinated, so NSW will have to figure that bit out as well.

Only time will tell what the details are.

Interestingly this may inadvertently result in a short term medical tourist boom in certain intermediary countries like Singapore whereby travellers from countries with non approved vaccines would arrive, and get their vaccines and stay in the country for 3-5 weeks before flying off to Australian or other destinations. It would of course require commercial access to Pfizer or Moderna vaccine (as currently the vaccine program is government run and for residents not short term travellers) as well as quarantine residential arrangements.

We can only hope and knowing Qantas yes we probably will get A380 flights earlier

Well, with SQ now committing to some 2021 A380 flights, at least there might now be some room at the ASP parking lot for QF to bring a couple of frames back to OZ and gradually prepare them for re-introduction to the network, on a sliding scale?

Otherwise, if QF remains with their Apr-May plan for June 2022 re-introduction, they'd be potentially ceding a significant marketing advantage (and some market share) to SQ which would amount to six months. 

Qantas doesn’t need to bring frames back to Australia to get them ready for service. The reason the A380’s are storage at Victorville is because they have their maintenance base just down the road at LAX. They would be capable if f getting them ready for service. 

Also there are two undergoing heavy maintenance and possibly cabin refit which could be brought back quickly. Bigger issue is getting crew ready. 

AJW - yes, I know exactly why QF chose to store them in the US desert. 

You miss my point though. As we are seeing - on a very regular basis - the estimations and policies of all our experts seemingly change at will. QF as a conservative managed company has a 'projected feel' for when they feel that the A380's should be re-introduced to the network. Initially that was a late 2023-early 2024 timeframe.

As is being seen (and experienced now), these schedules are not 'fixed in stone'. The initial timeline was modified to second half 2022 less than 3 weeks ago. It is clear that Government policy and 'market demand' will determine the actual, real return to service dates - and you can be quite sure that QF will be watching that.

There is a trusted and true Boy Scout saying known as "Be Prepared". My point was that QF could pull 2 frames back to Australia, where they could be stored short-term if progress is slower than anticipated. Conversely, with the ability to perform maintenance and rehabilitation quickly in both LAX and in Australia / Singapore or Phillipines, there are clear advantages in having multiple maintenance facilities.

When you look at the other A380 operators, EK, QR and BA are already moving on re-introducing their fleets. Just today, the Sydney Morning Herald is leading with a story that SQ is placing 320,000 sale tickets up for Australia (and that is virtually all SYD capacity) for November and December. So, clearly there will be demand over the Nov 2021-Feb 2022 period, if nothing else. That increasing stability or return to service will only give the public more incentive to book holidays, some O&D VFR travel and maybe the green shoots of business travel.  

Seems to me that there is substantial capacity being expected by respected industry players, don't you think?

Agreed but frankly it's a "two can play that game scenario". On one hand for months many of the COVID free states have been leisurely dithering on their border reopening plans rather than commit to a date or vaccination target that would enable a clear pathway to reunifying the county.

Now the tables are beginning to turn and NSW is rightfully pushing ahead with international opening despite the initial national plan stating a national average of 80% must be met. Why on earth would we do that if many states won't even open up to their own residents located in other states once that target is met.

Couldn't agree more filmfanatic. 

This is great for NSW but perhaps to Mr Perrottet's surprise not everyone lives there. 

I'm from Victoria and I will refrain from saying what I really think of our premier other than I dislike him, his policies and his reluctance to reopen. 

I don't see how this will go down well with him, the premiers of the other States, Territories  and republic of WA. (Seriously though well done to them for keeping COVID free.)

  We need an agreed national approach which I thought we had and agreed. 

I understood the quarantine although managed by states was federal mandated? How the f*ck is this going to work. Has Scotty agreed to it?  We are meant to be opening up Australia as a group effort with all the states on a national roadmap. Just seems to me everyone is doing their own fu*king thing and it will be a complete mess. 

This great in theory but a terrible idea really. 

The other states went off the plan at the first possible opportunity.  Dom has changed that cozy dynamic.

@Xyzxzz

I agreed that we needed a national approach but from my perspective, certain states had never abide to the national strategy for more than a few months when it suits them, and then throw off the facade when it doesn’t.

GlaBer made some remarks about how the National Cabinet agreement almost always come down to the most restrictive measures insisted by some states, but she had stuck to the agreement struck by the National Cabinet as much as I can tell.

Looks like DomPer had no qualms about pushing the limit since the other states (from the NSW perspectives) had been cherry picking what they will follow for the last 12 months and he certainly didn’t wait long enough to show what NSW is prepared to do ahead of the next national cabinet meeting.

At least we now know what the main agenda will be then.

Its a great idea as the other states and premiers need to get with the times - "we are in late 2021" not still living in 2022.

NSW have simply now caught up with the rest of the world like Europe, USA and UK in terms of vaccine rates and but also learning to live with Covid.

Home quarantine was never going to work and a logistical nightmare and frankly when you have such high levels of vaccination it makes zero sense to continue to quarantine fully vaccinated travellers. 

NSW isn't changing immigration policy. It is changing its own quarantine policy. Like all states, it was given delegated quarantine power by the Commonwealth in March last year. NSW is just using that delegated power. Just like Qld, Vic and WA have done.

Scomo will change very quickly to allowing International visitors as well.

it will change as a Fully vaccinated Englishmen, Frenchmen or Yank would i assume pose the exact same level of risk as a fully vaccinated Australian?

As @awboj (above) indicated above, Scomo just (at 2:35pm newscast) put Perrottet back in his box. 

According to the PM, the NSW situation will apply ONLY to Australian citizens, returning residents (as well as citizen's families). International students, immigrants and foreign tourists are specifically excluded - and apparently won't be considered until Part D of the National Plan comes into effect. 

Perrottet had indicated that his NSW policy would include foreign tourists immediately. It also turns out that he had written to the PM n this issue ... today. Clearly, this stuff-up was totally unco-ordinated and lacked any formal knowledge or approval. Not the brightest start ... 

The lack of co-ordination is frankly .. stunning. I guess that our PM is salivating in his 'vaccination' success - despite it being State-driven and sadly lacking in certain states. Perrottet has managed to wrest the spotlight away from Scotty, who is probably fairly grateful. On other matters, the PM (or Minister for Prevarification) has finally decided to attend a certain Scottish Climate-Change event - and will undoubtedly be able to happily return via Sydney (and hence avoid quarantine, whilst popping into to Cronulla for a quick family visit).

Who loves a 3 ring circus ? 

What a mess hey! I suspected that something such as what has occurred this afternoon might be the result. 

Whoever is advising Mr lots of kids about who he should be consulting with before making his big promises and big calls is not doing a very good job.

It doesn't matter if the international tourists don't return next month. It will happen by early next year anyway. It is a clever and deliberate ploy by Dom to push the re opening agenda and putting pressure on the other recalcitrant states to re open, not just internally, but externally too.

It is great that the hotel and home quarantines are eliminated. Sooner or later, the other states will be forced to do the same, which is the best thing to happen to this country. If we don't open and let go of restrictions and quarantines, when we are 80-90% vaxxed, when then ?! Don't forget that people still need to do the PCR test before departure and after arrival.

But Victoria is keeping the seven-day home quarantine requirement (which I understand all the states and territories agreed to as part of the COVID roadmap). This effectively means other states will need to maintain border controls with NSW, so you may still need to quarantine when you travel from NSW to Victoria. It seems like a dog's breakfast and hasn't been well thought out / coordinated at all. We're meant to live in a federation but it's every premier for themselves.

Victoria will come into line with NSW once we achieve 80%, especially as we are likely to get close to 90% fully vaccinated.

Dictator Dan will use this as an excuse to delay opening international borders and go off the roadmap. As much as I like the new NSW guy, he has just given Dan a reason. 

 Seriously how are they going to stop people flying to Sydney and then getting a domestic flight to Melbourne. Are they really suggesting that we'll have permits still next year??? 

Oldman Australian citizens and families including parents. I presume if the parents are not citizens they can come. Need to prove that at visa application which will be interesting. Children’s birth certificate perhaps.

It's actually Australian citizens and their immediate families, as well as permanent residents only.

Overseas students wishing to return to Australia and foreign tourists are specifically excluded.

They'll be repealed.

Stepandy the Feds had already announced the borders would open in November for citizens and residents to leave and return. All that has changed today is nsw saying no quarantine. 

From the start I thought quarantine was an authoritarian overreaction to what is a self-limiting flu that 99.8% of people recover from. If my understanding of history is correct, the last time Australia mass quarantined all arrivals was about 150 years ago, but back then many arrivals were actually sick, from their long sea voyages. Many suffered from scurvy and various diseases that have all but been wiped out today.

During Covid, many countries never required quarantine or at most, home quarantine and yet they didn't experience the next coming of the plague like the Australian media has insisted we would, had Australia not instituted facility quarantine.

This is an evolving story. What is now, will be different in a week and different again a week after that.

TripTrap, there is no restrictions on you travelling or your family coming in if you are a permanent resident. Therein may be the catch.

Might be political tactics to push the envelope. 

Furthermore it could be a matter of 

“I am opening up to all vaccinated travellers with no quarantine”, 

“no, you are not, I have the final say who can come in without quarantine”

“Ok if you want them to be quarantined, you find and run the quarantine then”

ScoMo may allow incoming flights to SYD to be uncapped for Aussies but may still have limits in issuing visas to non residents. Either way DomPer will get to free up more Sydney hotels and reduce state costs and resources in running the quarantine program and pretty much fire up discontent in the lack of clarity of when borders are open in some states.

Politically a win win in NSW for the new premier trying to assert himself 

New if you do some dummy bookings there are only fully flexible fares coming into Australia so there is obviously enough demand without tourists. If you look at fares going out there are lots of sale fares, so it is going out that the planes aren’t full. Australians are still nervous travelling. Even a mild covid case abroad to a fully vaccinated person is enough to completely wreck a holiday and block you from coming back until all symptoms and signs of the bug have passed. Sensible nervousness I say.

David,

There is a cap on unvaccinated of not very many for vaccinated residents and citizens there is no cap. Parents are now included in the list of family members that can visit so presumably yes they can come with no quarantine if fully vaccinated.

Patrick

My understanding is that there is still a cap on overseas visitors even if they are parents of Australian residents/citizens. (Whether or not they are fully vaccinated). Consequently flights into Australia and still very, if not, prohibitively expensive. 

Scooter from Announcements sat on the fence when Covid first started to appear, hence the States had to take charge of quarantining despite it clearly being a Federal legal responsibility. By doing that he lost authority, which he's now desperately trying to get back.  Hazzard, the other State health Ministers, and their advisors, really had no choice but to issues their dictates as there were none from Canberra. Whether we like them or not, and there have been some real stuff ups, it was the failure to take provide proper leadership from the Feds nationally that allowed this situation to develop where the States, both Labor and Lib/Nats, have gone off in different directions.