Qantas looks to order ultra-long range Airbus or Boeing jets in 2019
By David Flynn, June 3 2018
The countdown clock is ticking on Qantas' ambitious plans to launch non-stop flights from Sydney and Melbourne to London and New York, with the airline ready to place an order for ultra-long range Airbus or Boeing jets next year for flights from 2022.
"We're having good dialog with both Boeing and Airbus, and I think we're getting to a stage technically where we know what the aircraft is going to be in the next few months," Qantas CEO Alan Joyce said on the sidelines of the IATA aviation summit in Sydney.
"We're hopeful that if the business case works, in 2019 we’ll put an order in for the aircraft to arrive in 2022, and and I think Boeing and Airbus are keeping slots for us, so its feasible for us to do it at that stage."
Boeing is beavering away on extending the range of its new 777-8 jet, while Airbus is crunching the numbers on special ultra-long range versions of both the Airbus A350-900 and A350-1000.
Meanwhile, Qantas has already run the ruler over potential non-stop routes for what Joyce described as a "reasonably sized fleet" of the long-legged jets.
"London from Sydney and Melbourne and Brisbane is something we'd like to do (and) we have the slots in London," Joyce said. "We have Paris and Frankfurt on the list, so we'd like to work through whether they're do-able."
"But the big opportunity is also to the US," Joyce added, citing both New York and Chicago for possible non-stops. "We already fly a 747 from LA to New York so we know we can make that work today. the traffic's there for it."
David Flynn is the Editor-in-Chief of Executive Traveller and a bit of a travel tragic with a weakness for good coffee, shopping and lychee martinis.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
21 Jul 2014
Total posts 143
If Qantas did Sydney, Melbourne and Brisbane direct to London, poor Perth’s days would be numbered unless Qantas could secure additional slots
Qantas
19 Apr 2012
Total posts 1429
QF has four slots so Perth could still be in, the Sing stop would be the one to give up. There would be a non stop flight from each city. At around 300 seat each plus Perth gives 1100 seat or so, an small increase on the close to 1000seats they had with 2 A380s. This would suggest an economy cabin on the ULRs.
16 Feb 2016
Total posts 30
Yeh I think that provided PER airport get back on board with QF it will stay. PER will still be fed by ADL and regional QLD which should be enough to sustain daily. I think CDG and FRA would run through there as well and pick up the lower yielding connecting traffic.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
06 Dec 2017
Total posts 23
PER fed by regional QLD? Surely only via BNE.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
21 Jul 2014
Total posts 143
Oh yeah I forgot there were four pairs not three!
05 May 2016
Total posts 616
Whether they do four flights a day to LHR or not there will obviously be a transition period as they won't get all the new planes needed to do all the new direct non-stop flights all at once.
It'll be interesting to see what happens during that time. If they start with say SYD-LHR as they presumably would the question becomes does the A380 service SIN-LHR get scrapped then or if PER-LHR is getting scrapped does the A380 service get a temporary reprieve and become part of a MEL-SIN-LHR service till QF gets more of the Project Sunrise planes to enable them to do MEL-LHR direct non-stop as well?
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
17 May 2015
Total posts 54
I can think of nothing worse than sitting in a place for 18 hours without getting off.
Etihad - Etihad Guest
02 Mar 2018
Total posts 9
It's 14 to UAE, then 2 on the ground followed by 7 to London. I'd prefer to suck it up for 4 more hours and chop 5 hours off my journey. I think the demand is there.
18 Aug 2017
Total posts 39
And if thePER to LHR is 18 MEL to LHR is 22+
24 Oct 2017
Total posts 5
Totally agree with chap595, I do 6 flights to LHR per year and have tried numerous airlines. Have settled on Thai as Bankok as it pretty well breaks the journey in half
05 May 2016
Total posts 616
Flights from Perth if they continued would presumably still be on the 787 but I do wonder if they’d move that 787 to flying to a different European destination that they can’t justify flying to as part of Project Sunrise or stop flying the 787 via PER entirely and repurpose the 787 for flights to Asia or North America from the East Coast.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
26 Sep 2017
Total posts 2
Qantas should also look at flights from Perth using the ULR planes to destinations like LAX, SFO, YVR, LAS, SCL, or MEX.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
24 Apr 2014
Total posts 9
As much as would love that, I can not see that happening, nor would it make any sense. Perhaps PER to CDG or LAX would be the only ones that would have enough demand. LAX could connect with the hop to JFK but with Project Sunrise, I cant imagine that hop would be around for long.
QF
04 Apr 2014
Total posts 210
So if they fly direct from the east coast of Oz to New York what does that do to flights to LA? Do they duplicate, as in fly from Sydney / Melbourne / Brisbane to both LA and to New York? Or just Sydney to LA? Just that Joyce’s comment that they already fly LA to NY seems irrelevant as that flight is a continuation of the Brisbane - LA one and picks up passengers from the Sydney and Melbourne to LA flights.
05 May 2016
Total posts 616
The BNE-LAX flight is already planned to move to the smaller 787 from the larger 747.
17 Sep 2015
Total posts 371
mviy, you mean 'fewer' (for plural) rather than 'less.'
05 May 2016
Total posts 616
QF wants to fly point to point rather than via hubs.
However, if QF does fly more than two flights to LHR a day there will be a lot of economy seats on QF metal to LHR then. How that will compare to what there were with 2 x A380s we'll have to wait and see.
18 Aug 2017
Total posts 39
And 1 of the major delays is the staff at LAX through homeland.
QF
04 Apr 2014
Total posts 210
Irrelevant for outbound connections through LAX. Once you're airside you bypass TSA there. Incoming is soooo much better now than it used to be as well. Maybe the morning peak can catch people out but generally I get through on a paper visa (so no machines) in 30-45 minutes now, seat to curb. Even last week with the family and secondary processing we were out in under an hour.
QF
04 Apr 2014
Total posts 210
True re. connections in LA vs. Sydney. Even though LAX is an AA hub you can't beat the shear volume of options between MEL / SYD / BNE.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
18 Aug 2014
Total posts 72
Serious, around 20 hours,regardless what class you are in.
12 Aug 2017
Total posts 75
BNE > LHR? is there the numbers ti make it work?
05 May 2016
Total posts 616
I'm guessing QF will probably try SYD-LHR then do MEL-LHR and if both of those are a success they could well give BNE-LHR a try as well.
Remember that QF is planning to do other flights with the same aircraft such as SYD-JFK and they won't get all the aircraft at the same time.
The manufacturers can only make so many planes at a time and they're not only making planes for QF but many other airlines at the same time.
The delivery will be spaced out a bit like with the 787 rollout at the moment.
QF will see how the economics work for some key routes before adding others.
QF has historical data they can compare with for how MEL-PER-LHR, MEL-DXB-LHR etc. went that would give them an indication as to whether a direct non-stop flight from MEL will give them the market share increase that they're hoping for.
Remember also that SYD-LHR direct non-stop will have less capacity than the current A380 service and some of the current A380 traffic would be customers from BNE. I'm sure QF would have looked at the numbers on how many fly BNE-SYD-LHR.
Most of the loyal customer that fly to SYD so they can fly QF all the way would be expected to give a direct non-stop service from BNE a try.
It'll be interesting to see if QF extends the Emirates partnership again or not. If they don't then passengers who flew on QF marketed flights on Emirates may switch to the QF operated flights.
If they extend the partnership QF may try to get Emirates to reduce it's number of flights to Australia or move some onto smaller planes.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
13 Jan 2017
Total posts 74
Thumbs up to QF.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
17 Mar 2017
Total posts 28
But seriously, who can stand 20 hours of Qantas in-flight service - it's so variable. Just came back from QF first class to London. Going over the food in the SYD First lounge and on board was, let's be polite, 'ordinary'. Coming back was better, but not to other airlines' first class standards. Time perhaps to say good-bye to Mr Perry after 20 years - complacency has long since set in.
04 Jun 2018
Total posts 23
What about GRU or GIG? Would either of them still be on the cards ? Flying through SCL is always a nightmare because the ground staff doesn’t speak neither English nor Portuguese and the security check / Qantas luggage tag queues are ridiculously long.
12 Dec 2012
Total posts 1031
Now that LATAM Brasil (TAM) is part of oneworld, maybe they will.
Most of the overseas destionations QF are, or are looking at, flying to are hubs for partners.
Emirates Airlines - Skywards
11 Mar 2015
Total posts 190
Another 4 years,hopefully by than Branson comes up with the super shuttle so don't have to rot in a tube for 18 hours"
Emirates Airlines - Skywards
11 Mar 2015
Total posts 190
Anybody who flew via the Arabs knows what sort of a jam they produce,after all Dubai is the 4-5th largest airport in the world nowadays,at least you can omit that misery if u fly with qf but the question is if it worth it?
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
20 Mar 2012
Total posts 116
bl812, I flew the Qatar Q-Suites last week from DOH-LHR and I don't think they are as good as the marketing hype. I felt very claustrophobic in a single, forward facing window seat. Are they better than Qantas Business? Absolutely. Are they better than Qantas First? Not at all. Qantas First is leaps and bounds better; more space, better service and much nicer dining and drink options.
Qantas - Qantas Frequent Flyer
29 Jul 2013
Total posts 203
So what's going to happen to all the QF A380's when these Project Sunrise routes take off?
QF
04 Apr 2014
Total posts 210
They'll keep using them on routes that need the seats and into ports that have limited slots or gates. Personally if I have the choice I'd take a 380 over a 787 every time.
05 May 2016
Total posts 616
They’ll fly them to LAX still. Probably SIN and HKG as well. Perhaps they’ll still fly to DFW too.
06 Jan 2015
Total posts 66
Would also include Sydney-Tokyo to be a possible candidate.
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